| C4 - DS4 Owners :: Forums :: Citroen C4 Picasso and Grand C4 Picasso (B78) 2013 onward :: C4 Picasso and Grand C4 Picasso (B78) Problems and Issues |
<< Previous thread | Next thread >>
|
SOLVED- Coolant level goes low but NO sign of any leak- SEE MY LAST COMMENT |
    Please Register to enjoy additional Member Benefits |
|
Top Thanked Forum Posts: Today | Week | Month | Year | All time | Most Thanks Given: To member | By user
|
| Author | Post | ||||
jsg1163
 
|
|
||||
  Member No: #50650
Joined: Mar 09 2018Location: Birmingham |
Hello A couple of days ago, in the evening since I could not see it clearly how much coolant level is there, I decided to open the cap to check the coolant level. At this time the engine was cold, turned off for over 20 hours and the car was parked on a flat surface. There was still some pressure and all of a sudden the coolant level which was close to the "MIN" mark started to rise and came to just over "MAX" mark. I was not sure what had happened. Why did it move from MIN to MAX level mark? Yesterday I was about to set off for another long drive and checked that there was NO coolant in the tank. When I opened the cap to top it up, there was a pressure build up and heard the sound as the car was trying to do gargles. Still no sign of any coolant, so I topped it up to the MAX level. This afternoon I checked it again and it was below the MIN mark again (on a cold engine) and there is NO sign of any leakage. My driveway is all clear, the engine is all nice and clear, the car produces heat in few mins as usual and there is no other sign or warning. Before that, it was always fine. The coolant stays at the MAX level all the time. I do check this almost every week/fortnight and never seen the coolant level is low. I have now topped it up again and let's see what happens to it tomorrow. Can someone please shed some light on this what is happening? Why the car has started to lose the coolant level all of a sudden since after opening it the very first time a few days ago. Thanks in advance. |
||||
|
|
|||||
iscom
|
|
||||
   Member No: #20936
Joined: Jul 21 2011Location: Ireland Fermanagh & Galway |
Till you find out what the problems is, don't keep topping up with plain water as you will make coolant weak and the coolant keeps the water pump in good shape. In the old days you could get a pressure test via the radiator filer cap but I think this is not possible with modern cars but a dealer should be able to help you. If it was me I would get the engine hot and look for leeks |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
jsg1163
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #50650
Joined: Mar 09 2018Location: Birmingham |
I use the normal coolant liquid that you get from poundland/eurocarparts etc. and not tap water. I was not going to top it up but since I was leaving for a long journey and didn't want to hit the motorway knowing there is no coolant in the system or its been sucked in by the system. iscom wrote ... Till you find out what the problems is, don't keep topping up with plain water as you will make coolant weak and the coolant keeps the water pump in good shape. In the old days you could get a pressure test via the radiator filer cap but I think this is not possible with modern cars but a dealer should be able to help you. If it was me I would get the engine hot and look for leeks |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
FrankBullitt
|
|
||||
  Member No: #19238
Joined: Apr 12 2011Location: Cambridgeshire |
Your head gasket has gone Your description is exactly the same as the issue my DS4 has for about two months whilst it was backward and forward to the dealer - it was clearly not a huge leak in the gasket as some times it wouldn’t seemingly be affected after a drive. The tell-tale was still being pressurised when the engine was cold and had been overnight, the cylinders have pressurised the water system. I assumed there would be an immulsion on the underside of the oil filler cap but there was nothing; with hindsight the coolant bottle was a bit darker inside than it ought to have been. Mine was done under warranty which was good news as the garage took about 16 hours to do the job (they’d never done a 2.0HDi ‘blue’ before) but the 1.6HDi shouldn’t take anywhere near as long! |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
jsg1163
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #50650
Joined: Mar 09 2018Location: Birmingham |
Is it a big job. How much you recon it'll cost? FrankBullitt wrote ... Your head gasket has gone Your description is exactly the same as the issue my DS4 has for about two months whilst it was backward and forward to the dealer - it was clearly not a huge leak in the gasket as some times it wouldn’t seemingly be affected after a drive. The tell-tale was still being pressurised when the engine was cold and had been overnight, the cylinders have pressurised the water system. I assumed there would be an immulsion on the underside of the oil filler cap but there was nothing; with hindsight the coolant bottle was a bit darker inside than it ought to have been. Mine was done under warranty which was good news as the garage took about 16 hours to do the job (they’d never done a 2.0HDi ‘blue’ before) but the 1.6HDi shouldn’t take anywhere near as long! |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
iscom
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #20936
Joined: Jul 21 2011Location: Ireland Fermanagh & Galway |
Depends who does the work from £500 - £1000+ Citroen Cylinder Head Gasket Replacement cost Name Independent garage estimate Citroen C4 Parts costs: £15 - £447 Labour time: 7-17 hours £373 - £1186 Its a lot of money if you have not budget for such repairs I always have a car fund which I save for repairs and service like a did last week ( 650 euro) |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
routemaster1
|
|
||||
 Member No: #574
Joined: Jul 08 2007Location: Dorset |
iscom wrote ... Depends who does the work from £500 - £1000+ Citroen Cylinder Head Gasket Replacement cost Name Independent garage estimate Citroen C4 Parts costs: £15 - £447 Labour time: 7-17 hours £373 - £1186 Would be a good idea to have the system pressure tested before starting to strip down. Again, shows how vital the extended warranty is. |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
iscom
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #20936
Joined: Jul 21 2011Location: Ireland Fermanagh & Galway |
Jarnail Just a thought assuming that it is a blown head gasket do you thing this has anything with your leaking injector a few months back? ( if it was you who had the problem) |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
jsg1163
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #50650
Joined: Mar 09 2018Location: Birmingham |
Update: So I checked the car coolant tank at 5:30 pm yesterday and it was way above the MAX level (on a cold engine). Still maintained the pressure in the system. I didn't open the cap and started my 50-50 mins motorway journey. I hit 70 mph for 2-3 mins and the temp gauge reached to the maximum and touched the red level also had ENGINE TEMP TOO HIGH message and asked to stop the vehicle. I slowed down to 50-60 mph and the temp level came down to normal range and all warning messages done. Continued my rest of the journey as normal and due to the rush hour, I couldn't go over 60 mph anyway. Reached home and at the hot engine, checked the coolant level again and it was at MIN level. Didn't open the cap or anything. Checked the level again at 9 pm (at a cold engine) and it was same at MIN level with good pressure in the coolant tank. This morning, just before setting off for work, checked the level again and it was the same as night. Hit the motorway and noticed there is NO heating even after 20 mins of driving. The temp gauge was showing the normal temperature. So I turned the fan off and after 1 min, turned it back on and heating started to work. Could it be the water pump failing to circulate the water fast enough when driving at high speed, resulting in the engine temp to increase? Other Conclusion: 1. The system does hold pressure as normal. 2. If there was a leak, it would have emptied the tank overnight or whilst driving. 3. If there was a leak, it would not hold the pressure even after 10-15 hours. 4. There is NO oil in coolant and there is NO water in engine oil so the head gasket looks good. 5. Opened the coolant tank cap and turned the engine on, there was NO bubble in the coolant tank, showing that there is NO air trap in the system and combustion gases are not entering the coolant tank. |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
FrankBullitt
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #19238
Joined: Apr 12 2011Location: Cambridgeshire |
It’s worth getting it checked but there is really only one way that the cooling system can remain pressurised after being left cold for so long. I had no warning lights until mine properly overheated but by then the damage was done by a combination of the fault not cooling sufficiently and the second issue of it not being identified until way too late. Including Labour I think the bill for mine was about £2k at main dealer warranty prices, the head had to be skimmed which required a thicker gasket to be fitted; there were 5 depths on my engine and only 2 of them were in stock, needless to say the one we needed was on back order. I am surprised they skimmed it, as were my dealer who expected Citroen to insist on a new head. It’s d imagine budgeting for about £750 from a decent local garage sounds about right depending on whether the head needs skimming. EDIT; you’re going through all the thoughts I had when going back and forth to the dealer - I too wondered if it was a water pump fault |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
|||||
|
jsg1163
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #50650
Joined: Mar 09 2018Location: Birmingham |
Booked it in for a complete check at an independent garage for £40 for 1 hour of checks and tests etc. Let's see what is the outcome. Will update here soon. |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
|||||
|
jsg1163
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #50650
Joined: Mar 09 2018Location: Birmingham |
UPDATE 2: Called the AA breakdown and they confirmed the water pump had gone and got it towed to the local garage and he did a proper diagnosis and confirmed that that: 1. water pump is working fine 2. The Thermostat is opening and closing at the correct temp. 3. Radiator is clear 4. No air-lock in the system 5. Temp sensor is working fine The ISSUE is that water/ coolant gets sucked out of the container and does not run in the circulation. So on a cold engine, when it looks like the container is empty and you try to open the cap (to top it up), it comes back into the container and sometimes starts to overflow. Booked the car with the main dealer (Citroen Small Heath Birmingham) now for 15th Apr and let's see what they say. Will keep you posted. |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
FrankBullitt
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #19238
Joined: Apr 12 2011Location: Cambridgeshire |
Good luck - I know what my money is on though! | ||||
|
|
|
||||
|
jsg1163
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #50650
Joined: Mar 09 2018Location: Birmingham |
UPDATE 3: So dropped my car off to Citroen Birmingham in Small Heath this morning. When I booked the appointment, I was told that £60 is the diagnosis fee for the garage even if they spend 1 hour or 1 day. I questioned that what if the garage can't find the root cause in a day, I was told that the garage will inform you by phone that they want to keep your car for another day BUT you still pay £60. Anything extra will be informed and confirmed by you before any work is being carried out. This is all recorded by the company as they say all calls are recorded. I got a call from the Service Manager and he said that after spending about 30 mins, they THINK that the thermostat is causing the issue and it will cost about £480 parts and labor. I asked for a written confirmation that this will solve the issue and the manager said they are not 100% sure. It could be the water pump and that will be extra about £600 (after changing the thermostat for no reason). And if it is not the water pump then it may be the gasket, that would be in four figure amount (means by that time we would have changed thermostat and water pump for no reason). I said the thermostat was changed 3 weeks ago and I have all the receipts and paperwork so it can't be that. Cut long story short, I was told to pay £99 per hour for further diagnosis on the car as the initial £60 was only for 30 mins. This is totally different from what I was told by their service booking customer care person. So I phoned the service booking department again to confirm everything that they said to me initially and I were again told that £60 for the diagnosis regardless of the time taken (1 hour or 3 hours or 1 day). I went to the garage and picked up my car and refused to pay as they can't be sure what is causing the issue and they couldn't argue back and simply handed over the keys. Do you think I should report them or go to other Citroen garage or Independent garage? What I know is that I think it is the time to get rid of my C4 GP before it gives me more grief. Any suggestions...! TIA |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
iscom
|
|
||||
|
Member No: #20936
Joined: Jul 21 2011Location: Ireland Fermanagh & Galway |
Try a independent Citroen service garage Such as Citroen Specialists Stirchley or Monmore Green Works Walsall maybe be a bit far but think you will get a a good second opinion |
||||
|
|
|
||||
Go to page >>
|
|
 User Colour Key:Head Administrator, Administrator, Forum Moderator, Forum Moderator, Premier Member, Technical Expert, New C4 and DS4 Forum Moderators, Member |
|
Site Disclaimer | Privacy Policy | Cookie Policy |Contact Details | Car Warranty | Sitemap | RSS Feeds | C4 Insurance | Tutorials | Quick Facts | Used Car Guide | Re Call Info | Offers | Service Reviews | Technical Documents | Error Codes
Theme by e107wORks© 
With Graphics from: Dave Forum Icons by Axialis Emotes by Seb
