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1.6HDi EGS Red dashboard self revving - scary!! |
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tomhanman
 
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  Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
Hi all, I did a bit of general maintenance on my 2006 C4 before Christmas, replaced the EGR valve as I was getting warnings and codes and hesitations and decided to try that (it may well have been for nothing), I changed the pads, all the engine cover and cold air/ air filter housing rubber bungs so things stopped vibrating, the heatshield fixings, the turbo clamp and oil and filters. When changing the pads, a little oil fluid leaked out of the reservoir over whatever is below it whilst I was under the car. I put everything back together and it ran better... for about 10 minutes, then it started losing gear and went totally crazy. it would rev itself up - or at least when dropping out of gear it would rev as I had my foot on the pedal, but it didn't drop the revs when I took my foot off the pedal! It revved up so high the whole rev counter on the steering wheel backlight turned from amber to red, I had never seen that happen, and didn't eve know it could happen. It was very scary. I stopped the engine and restarted it, it ran normally and everything works normally in 1st gear, and mostly it will change into 2nd and will run perfectly, but then I have to put it into manual as if I let it try to change into 3rd it will drop out of gear and give me it's evil red grimace. So I left the car alone feeling grumpy about the effort I had made to look after it and how it was repaying me! Occasionally I have used it to see if it is miraculously fixed. It is not, but it will run fine for the first ten minutes every time (basically until something gets warm) then its 2nd gear max. Now I need to get it sorted, I have Lexia, and the codes are: ELECTRIC EGR VALVE COPY SIGNAL VOLTAGE TOO LOW QWL-P0405 0RPM OAIRFLOW 94MvEGRSTATUS 100%EGR POSITION FAULT TITLE NOT AVAILABLE ZZZ-P0000 NO COMMS WITH ENGINE MANAGEMENT ECU INCORRECT VALUE RECEIVED HWX-U1208 INTERRUPTION OF COMMUNICATION WITH THE ECU INFORMATION SENT BY THE ENGINE ECU INCORRECT VALUE RECEIVED K1X-U1208 ENGINE RUNNING INFORMATION HBZ-C1210 FAULT NOT REFERENCED IN AFTER SALES Does anyone have any ideas? could it be the EGR valve I have installed (new ebay Ford/Peugeot/Citroen generic), or could it be the connections on the gearbox that have taken brake fluid, or could it be a fusebox problem, or could it be a coincidence that it started after my works? Any help much appreciated. I will be checking connections and trying a BSI reset this afternoon. Sorry for the long post, but I think it provides important info for diagnosis. Look forward to your miracles, Cheers, Tom. |
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Dave_Retired.
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   Member No: #1
Joined: Aug 07 2006Location: Northumberland |
You need to post the error codes themselves, not the 'descriptions' so we can take a look in the database. However have you checked the oil level in the sump and is it OK? |
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tomhanman
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Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
Hi Dave, thanks for the quick reply. Yes oil level is fine. This is definitely not a case of diesel in oil engine runaway, it is electronic and related to the gearbox... and that is the problem. There appears to be a poor connection between ecu's (at the best, or a breaking down ecu at the worst). The fault codes are: P0406 when cold then P0405 when hot P0000 " U1208 " C1210 " Many thanks again for the attention, Tom. |
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tomhanman
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Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
OK I have got lexia working again now, and have taken a list of all faults present in the log; These are those that seem to ralate to this incident 0405 (P405) INJECTION 0406 (P406) INJECTION 0000 (P000) INJECTION F522 SATURATION OF FAULTS D208 (U1208 GEARBOX) FC82 (0C82) COMMUNICATION WITH THE TRANSPONDER TOP OF COLUMN 9651 (0651) F406 ENGINE OIL PRESSURE SENSOR (0406) 539D (C139D) ABS LONGITUDINAL ACCELERATION SENSOR CALIBRATION IMPOSSIBLE 7155 (0155) BSI ECU COOLANT TEMPERATURE INFORMATION OTHER REGULAR FAULTS ARE: F98A (098A) BSI ECU F98B (098B) BSI ECU I think these two are due to my LED replacement front sidelights and probably to be ignored. They are the only two that are constant faults and are back after a fault log erase. I can't run the engine at the moment because I have started removing the new EGR valve to replace the old one and see if that changes anything. When it is running I will update... but please feel free to help in the meantime! Also noted oil level at 49% according to ecu (although it is above 3/4 on the stick) And Fuel additive bag was apparently at 107% full. Which sounds unlikely. I have had it from 27000miles to 55000miles today and have never added any fluid. I also noted that the capacity of the bag was programmed at 1.8l whilst the lexia help info suggested it should be 2.0l so I changed that and it now shows 96% full. I ran the actuator tests on the additive pump and it certainly ran fine - no way of telling if it actually added anything. So even (and its unlikely) if the previous seller filled up the additive bag before selling it to me, is there any way that it could have used only 80cc in 28OOOmiles? Things to mull over. |
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Dave_Retired.
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Member No: #1
Joined: Aug 07 2006Location: Northumberland |
P0405 and 0406 relate to the EGR valve looking at this - Click Here - | ||
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tomhanman
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Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
Yeah, thanks Dave, I have looked these things up - as I said in my first post, I had error messages relating to the EGR valve to start with and thats why I changed it... but more worrying and infinitely more complex (and hence why I have posted here) are the other codes that relate to a lack of comms between the ECUs. I am just finishing up putting the original EGR valve back in place and will give it a test like that to see if I got a dodgy replacement valve... if only it could be that simple. |
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Dave_Retired.
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Member No: #1
Joined: Aug 07 2006Location: Northumberland |
The other thing you may want to check if it's a lack of comms is the engine bay fusebox | ||
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tomhanman
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Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
Yep I'd mention that in my first post as well. Although the problems weem to be mostly picasso related. Either way, I was looking for a bit more precision before I randomly start changing things! I've just put the old theoretically faulty EGR valve back on, and although it kicked up a whole load of faults on my journey, it did manage half an hour of driving without pretending it was the devil. So I am wondering if I might have a broken egr valve and have bought a totally duff egr valve that has caused other things. Or maybe it is just a momentary coincidence. I also gave the contacts on the gearbox actuator a wiggle, but couldn't work out how to actually remove the forward connector, which is crazy. Maybe that had an effect because its not the most solid of connectors. So now after my return journey I still had the ESP/ABS warning on, and the emissions, and the codes were as follows: 0409 P409 injection egr valve sticking during initialisation 0489 P489 injection Position indicator signal of the EGR valve : Negative loop difference 1162 P1162 injection EGR valve position copy signal intermittent 7510 0150 vehicle speed info incorrect value received / drivers and passengers airbags F924 0924 HIFI amp operation / radio or radiotelephone 7155 0155 coolant temp information BSI ECU C91A 091A rear right hand audio open circuit / radio or radiotelephone 539D C139D longitudinal acceleration sensor calibration impossible / ABS |
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Dave_Retired.
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Member No: #1
Joined: Aug 07 2006Location: Northumberland |
Have a look at this previous post - Click Here - | ||
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tomhanman
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Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
Hi Dave, Yeah, thats interesting, thanks. I don't know if you noticed what wrote about the recorded level of the additive fluid being virtually full - as if it never regenerates. Of course if it doesn't regen, then it would be blocked up, and maybe causing some of these problems. Problem is I don't really see how to find out if the particle filter is blocked. when I try and test it Lexia tells me this isn't available for my car. Does anyone know how much fluid is supposed to be added per actuation of the additive pump? I can actuate it using lexia and hence see if the recorded level drops accordingly. Or if one can actually see the fluid squirting into the filler neck? I shall try and investigate the magnet which is supposed to be on the filler cap. The joy of OBD. |
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tomhanman
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Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
Well had another long session on Lexia and retreived a load of supposedly useful info on the particle filter and additive system: particle soot load 49% average distance between regens 257km weight of additive in filter 36g amount of additive remaining in tank 2478ml additive system fault: additive addition impossible particle filter in/out diff 3.9mb at 800rpm 25mb at 2500rpm distance since last regen 0km The fault that is mentioned shows up nowhere else, no codes or anything. I think maybe it says that because I have actuated the test several times and it is refusing to add any more fluid into a nearly empty fuel tank, but don't know. I should also add that it never ever smokes, ever. The inside of the tailpipe is shiny metal colour not sooty. Both magnets are present in the filler cap and both stick to metal So all this doesn't really help orient me in a direction. I don't understand how it can still contain 2478ml when the tank is only supposed to contain 2l. Is the pressure differential within norms? I did a load of resets and it is definitely better with the old EGR valve - it works albeit running a bit lumpy and hesitation in acceleration from tickover. But today (with all the sound insulation and windscreen plastics removed) a clicking sound coming from the air doser (or throttle body). It was coming specfically from the EGR butterfly. And when I unplugged its connector the sound stopped. So it was as if either the actuator is receiving a hesitant on/off signal through a bad relay or knackered ECU output or bad connection, or the actuator itself is tired. Any bets on which to go for? It made no difference when I tried moving the connector around searching for a loose connection there. The actuator responds seemingly well to the actuator test (in that I hear a good solid click). There is a second hand doser correct for my car on ebay for £60 at the moment. Do you think that is worth a gamble or does it sound more like the problem(s) are elsewhere? Incidentally the doser appears in otherwise perfect condition, no oil, no leaks etc. Thanks again. |
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tomhanman
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Member No: #17758
Joined: Feb 01 2011Location: France |
Its just a fountain of knowledge around here! Guess I'm on my own then. |
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CamM
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  Member No: #19249
Joined: Apr 13 2011Location: Sydney |
tomhanman wrote ... Its just a fountain of knowledge around here! With all due respect Tom, sarcasm is not going to do anything to encourage others to try and assist. Everyone on here volunteers their time, knowledge and experience to try and help others. There's no guarantee that members will know the answer to every question, or indeed be able to provide the correct solution 100% of the time. Any advice is offered on a good faith basis and occasionally, there's no better alternative than to have a Citroën expert examine your vehicle. Good luck with identifying a solution to the problem. I'm sure everyone will be interested to learn what you discover if you care to post on the eventual outcome. |
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Dave_Retired.
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Member No: #1
Joined: Aug 07 2006Location: Northumberland |
tomhanman wrote ... Yep I'd mention that in my first post as well. Although the problems weem to be mostly picasso related. Either way, I was looking for a bit more precision before I randomly start changing things! The engine bay fusebox issue affects all early C4's I'm afraid, not just the C4 Picasso's If we had an answer to your question someone would have responded but as the issue has never arisen before, (apart from several turbo runaways) we are not in a position to offer any constructive advice I'm afraid, or members would have. |
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