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C4GP Brilliant explanation for a sticking fuel filler flap |
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kryten77
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Well my C4GP 1.6Hdi VTR+ has now passed the 2000 mile mark. Still loving it except that now I have a fuel filler flap which refuses to open when the button inside the cabin is pressed. I have to rely on someone outside the car sliding a finger nail between the gap and pulling the flap out as I press the button inside the car. Phoned the dealer's service department only to be told.....Wait for it..... "It is probably a software fault...."  Its a what ?... What software is involved in opening the filler flap ? Anyone got any ideas ? The more contact I have with this dealer the funnier /more frustrating it gets. This is not a One man operation either. It is the largest Motor Dealership Group in Scotland and has franchises for almost every make of car there is. So anyone else had this problem ? and was it a software fault 
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hertsnminds
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  Member No: #1276
Joined: Oct 09 2007Location: Scotland |
Could well be a software fault as most buttons and controls in the C4 are not directly connected to the item they operate and have to have instructions relayed by one of the cars computers. You push the accelerator and it doesn't pull a cable that opens a valve. It tells the computer the accelerator has been moved, the computer then decides depending upon things like outside temperature, wheel slip, if you have the speed limiter set, etc etc if it will open the valve in the engine to let more fuel in. |
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Phil
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     Member No: #406
Joined: Jun 16 2007Location: Stafford |
Arnold Clark by any chance?   Is there any noise emitted from the flap when the button's pressed, or nothing at all? |
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kryten77
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There is a clicking sound from the flap, it can be opened as I say , but only if someone sticks a fingernail into the gap between the flap and the bodywork and gently pulls outwards. Its not Arnold Clark but the one which seems to own every motor dealership in the North/South Lanarkshire area. They own a Bentley franchise in Hamilton. Update : I had the car at the dealers today for inspection of this fault. They took it into the workshop, came back after 30 mins and told me it was OK. I went to the garage 100 yards along the road, tried to open filler flap to put diesel into car and guess what.....Yip it wouldnt open. As i was standing there ranting and raving like a nutter who did I see putting petrol in at one of the other pumps but the Service Manager . Told him what the score was, 5 mins later I had two mechanics and an "Auto Electrician" at the car. He'd phoned from his mobile and kicked up hell. Seems it is the small motor actuator for the release mechanism thats goosed. He's allegedly got one on 24 hour delivery so car goes in Today (Tuesday) again to get this fixed. 
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glitteryb
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Ahh .... Parks of hamilton then? Went to their EK branch for my test drive but ended up ordering from Citroen Glasgow as i found their motability guy nicer/more efficient, although motability switched my servicing over to Motorway Cars in Coatbridge, who seem ok. | ||||
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magnatom
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I have the same problem with my fuel cap. The other day I manage to get it to open on it's own after the 5th attempt (I didn't have a helper). Interestingly just after I got it opened another G4GP driver pulled up next to me at the garage and suggested that he'd had and was still having the same problem. Seems like a common problem. Anyone else having problems with this? Forgot to ask. kryten77 did you get this fixed? |
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kryten77
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Update on the Fuel filler cap problem. It has now been back to the dealer twice since I posted it. First time : It was taken into workshop for the "new parts " to be fitted, 30 minutes later car is outside and I'm told that problem is sorted. "We operated the filler cap a dozen or so times without problem ". So me being the trusting type asked them to show me it working ...Guess what ?? It didn't work. "Don't know how that happened. Maybe its the way you are operating the switch". What the hell does that mean. Its a push button, you push it and the filler cap is supposed to open, end of story. Back to the workshop it went , No joy in finding what the fault was so they ordered another set of parts for it. Second time : Same as the first up to the bit where instead of it being the way I push the button , its now the way I close the flap. I'm now losing the will to live whilst dealing with the service department. The car is going back today for a third attempt at finding out what the hell is wrong with a car that cost over £18000 yet wont let you fill the bl**dy thing with fuel. This was the first instance on here I had seen of this problem but having spoken to a couple of Taxi drivers in my area who have bought these cars it seems that it could be the same as the double vision issue and all of these models will have it at some time or another. |
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blueclouduk
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You really do have to admire the balls of the service department for giving the reasons for the non-functionality. "It's the way you push the button" and "It's the way you close the flap". Absolutely cracking.  Seriously, I do think it's indicative of a growing trend. Unfortunately, most dealerships, irrespective of the marque they serve, will only do what is absolutely necessary to fix a fault under warranty. This is not because they are lazy but because the manufacturers will only pay what they believe is the absolute minimum to fix the fault. So if a dealership gets it wrong then it is highly likely that they will be responsible for the rest of the labour and somtimes parts costs. I used to work for a Merc dealership and the warranty procedure was a nightmare to administer. Every last bit of time had to be accounted for and every last part used had to be detailed. Mercedes use a digital clock. Some warranty jobs are scheduled in the maintenance manuals as taking only 0.1 of an hour (yep, 6 minutes) and so the dealership is only allowed to charge MBUK for 0.1 of an hour. Parts are only allowed to be charged back at supply cost plus a very small administration fee. Every single warranty submission was scrutinised by MBUK and it could take up to 3 months for payment to be received. With procedures like this in place it is no wonder that dealerships dislike warranty work that involves diagnostics like this case as it can end up costing the dealership money. In my own experience I have always used a different dealership in the event that a fault is not fixed the first time. It is human nature to skip procedures if they have been done before. A different dealership would not know the history and would complete a more thorough investigation. I would also ask for a full break-down of all the work done to the car and a hard-copy - you may not be paying for the work but you are legally entitled to know what changes (if any) and what work has been done to what is your property. P.S. I've not yet had any problems with my fuel filler cover other than forgetting to close it once in London a couple of weeks ago.  (A senior moment perhaps)
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Phil
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Member No: #406
Joined: Jun 16 2007Location: Stafford |
kryten77 wrote ... Update on the Fuel filler cap problem. It has now been back to the dealer twice since I posted it. First time : It was taken into workshop for the "new parts " to be fitted, 30 minutes later car is outside and I'm told that problem is sorted. "We operated the filler cap a dozen or so times without problem ". So me being the trusting type asked them to show me it working ...Guess what ?? It didn't work. "Don't know how that happened. Maybe its the way you are operating the switch". What the hell does that mean. Its a push button, you push it and the filler cap is supposed to open, end of story. Back to the workshop it went , No joy in finding what the fault was so they ordered another set of parts for it. Second time : Same as the first up to the bit where instead of it being the way I push the button , its now the way I close the flap. I'm now losing the will to live whilst dealing with the service department. The car is going back today for a third attempt at finding out what the hell is wrong with a car that cost over £18000 yet wont let you fill the bl**dy thing with fuel. This was the first instance on here I had seen of this problem but having spoken to a couple of Taxi drivers in my area who have bought these cars it seems that it could be the same as the double vision issue and all of these models will have it at some time or another. When you go back in, tell them that there is a bulletin on this. No replacement parts are neccessary! Mention Info Rapid C4 Picasso - 8 - No. 40. |
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kenjo
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I've had the same problem. I presume that the locking mechanism is operating as I can hear a click when I press the button. Could the problem be that the rubber seal is just sticking to filler surround. Perhaps a stronger spring on the filler cover would allow the flap to break the bond between the rubber and surround? | ||||
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Dave_Retired.
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 Member No: #1
Joined: Aug 07 2006Location: Northumberland |
Phil wrote ... When you go back in, tell them that there is a bulletin on this. No replacement parts are neccessary! Mention Info Rapid C4 Picasso - 8 - No. 40. What is the actual published fix then Phil? |
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Fredflite
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I have the opposite problem, my filler cap comes open too easily. People are always telling me my filler cap is open which could prove very expensive if it is open when reversing through a narrow gateway. | ||||
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kryten77
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Yippee, I now have a working fuel filler flap. They have replaced the actuator motor that moves the locking pin in/out. they also replaced the fitting on the rear of the filler flap and something inside the rear wing where the filler flap mounting strut goes inside the body. In short they have replaced the whole lot. Not that I'm complaining but for this to be happening on a car that is less than 9 Weeks old is ridiculous. Oh well , I suppose this is part of the joy of driving a "cutting edge" car. Hope everyone else with this problem gets theirs sorted out , coz its a bit weird having to ask total strangers to stick their finger in your flap and pull gently  
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Dave_Retired.
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Member No: #1
Joined: Aug 07 2006Location: Northumberland |
Sounds an awful lot like - well err we have no idea so we'll just change everything and hope for the best 
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kenjo
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I mentioned the problem when I visited the dealer today. Claimed he had not heard of the problem with others. Having demonstrated the problem we both came to the conclusion that it is the rubber seal on the flap that is sticking to the filler tube as I suggested earlier. We applied some light grease to the edge of the filler and this seems to have improved the frequency of opening - now opens 1 in 2 pushes rather than 1 in 10. You might like to try this and see if you get any improvement. At least I wasn't told it was a software problem! | ||||
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